https://www.dlsite.com/maniax/work/=/product_id/RJ01153232.html

Read tag definition pages, then comment.

"Shemale counts as female in regards to any relevant tag namespaces."

Do we need summon admin to explain to you (again)?

Base +7, HHHello -6, Feftak +27, PokeDude490 +6, BonoBono08 +6, Sylvrwolflol +8, Moonlights31 +9, Amuro1X +8, monkehmeh +6, nosoul0 +6, Last_Magic -6, flurrymouse -6, Guardian of Loli +29, and 4 more...

@Mr_Follow
Please, if that's the worst of the tag abuse you're seeing, you're damned lucky. It seems like there's practically no oversight for half the tags anymore. I can't even count the instances I've seen yuri and females only getting applied to dickgirl on female content, and corruption is basically a lost cause at this point.

Base +7, 0bserver2539 +3, Blaze Viper +6

觉醒了心中的雌 suki😌😌😌

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@monnoroth2nd
The vast majority people just assume "Shemale counts as female in regards to any relevant tag namespaces" means if a shemale gets fucked in the ass and does a titjob put anal or paizuri under the female tag and that's it. The admins' interpretation genuinely comes off as rules lawyering bullshit from a card game, 'well the rules don't say pot of greeds effects can't stack or be not reused so I can use it 10 of them in a row to get my whole deck in my hand'. Yes I know my metaphor breaks down a bit since it's the admins' fucking game, and they can decide whatever they want, but hopefully you get my point.

Note that phrase "Shemale counts as female in regards to any relevant tag namespaces." is only under the shemale definition and not under the gender change, If it was that important you would think it would be mentioned under gender change tag. Even feminization mentions gender change, but also is phrased as "invokes m:gender change if his gender actually changes changes." which this argument was mentioned before in a previous gallery. It gives the impression the phrase "or has his body altered into that of a shemale/futanari" does not directly invoke gender change. If it was the intention was male->shemale=gender change then the wording would be something like "invokes m:gender change if he changes to a female or shemale/futanari" Especially since it's a wiki, can be easily changed to reflect that. And yet it has not even though this issue has happened multiple times.

We. Need. Explicit. Clarity. In. The. Definitions. Just. Having. People. Mentioning. The. Admins. Interpretation. Is. Not. Enough.

Last edited on 20 March 2024, 13:41.

Base +6, Last_Magic +6

[Wow that's long comment, yet lack of substance. So I will tell you the simplest way]

Start as male then become shemale counts as gender change.
Because shemale was under female tag.

Isn't that clear enough?

It's like base math

If S = F
and if F = M x Gb

Then S = M x Gb

Last edited on 20 March 2024, 14:56.

Base +7, Last_Magic -6, FNFD2 +6

Okay ouch, but fair enough it was wordy.

I'll dumb it down as well

If male->shemale=gender change, the admins need to change the definition to explicitly mention it under the gender change, tag so there's no room for misinterpretation.

Otherwise this drama will keep on happening and some people might even vote against the tag out of spite, which has happened multiple times.

Do You Understand?

Base +6, NkFlower +6

You need only basic logic to understand that tag rule.

If someone misinterpretation that simple rule... well, good luck with highschool exam. You need serious tutor after school.

Base +7, Last_Magic -6

There's no need to insult me over this, I understand perfectly. We are having this discussion because people have a misinterpretation in the first place. In fact you got owned the first time around because of it since people used the core definition against you.

I will explain why one could misinterpret the rule.

For many people gender and sex are synonyms, that means exactly or nearly the same as another word.

Gender = Sex

So Gender change = Sex change

Male becomes Female = sex change

Male becomes Futanari = Sex Change

Male becomes a Shemale =/= sex change
Not a sex change because the man does not gain a vagina, aka becomes female

Nothing in the core definition of gender change page contradicts this interpretation.

The phrase "Shemale counts as female in regards to any relevant tag namespaces" which the admins claim as proof otherwise, but it is only found under the shemale definition.

Most people assume that's just for tagging convenience and preventing people tagging pazuri in the male tag or every male x shemale work as yaoi. nothing more nothing less, so it does not contradict their 'wrong' interpretation.

Do you understand, or was this still too wordy for you?

Base +6, NkFlower -6

When you type "gender = sex"

In That exact moment, your argument already lost.

There is no line in that paragraph or page that support your argument.
Basically all your comments are baseless assumption.

With your argument, it could also imply that futa are also under male tag, because they have male genital.
And Male to futa will not invoke gender change.
Weird, isn't it?

Like i said, read the rule again.

Woman, futa, or shemale are under one tag banner : Female
Anything that switch between under male tag to female (or vice versa) WILL invoke gender change.

Now I will repeat what you said, "Do you understand, or was this still too wordy for you?"

Your argument are base on "assumption".
My argument are base on "rule".

In the end, by this web consensus, have decided : "man become shemale are same with man become futanari or woman. It was Gender Change". Wether you like it or not.

EDIT, added note, the final verdict :
The official definition now prescribes that feminization only be separate from gender change in cases where the transition stops at crossdressing and no change into shemale, futa, or full female takes place. In other words, to keep feminization separate from gender change except in cases where a change into futa/shemale takes place. No vagina is needed. So most cases of feminization end up being tagged as "gender bender" and the tags don't end up being very distinct.

Added note :
I also apologized for insulting you, @MedNed all the fault was from me to lost my keyboard control

Last edited on 20 March 2024, 18:22.

Base +7, Last_Magic -6, NkFlower +6

We getting sidetracked here. I understand the proper definition, the logical reasoning behind it, and I understand you are frustrated. I was attempting to be a devil's advocate to show how the current definition of gender change as it now is flawed considering how many times the mods had come into the comments to clarify, due the lack of info it's page. I just think it's perfectly reasonable for the wiki definition to edited to be more clear, that's all. Especially since we have the following statement within the gender change definition:

* "A female becoming a futanari does not qualify."

Is it really that unreasonable to add a similar statement for shemales as well? Something like:

* "A male becoming a shemale does qualify"

What is preventing the admins from doing this? We wouldn't have as many arguments over this if something like this was added to the gender change wiki definition. Yes we shouldn't really need a 'redundant' statement if people aren't morons, but they are morons. IngmarS used the current definition against you verbatim, the people sided with him, (incorrectly), and not you. This would tip the scales in your favor if the wiki definition had a explicit statement on this.

Thank you for the apology. This whole situation is genuine pain in the ass, it's basically futanari vs shemale tagging all over again.

Base +6

Shemale is UNDER female tag. But also futanari.
Then, If people could define shemale as male, so does futanari is a male.

Especially when it comes gender change, they started as a man.

What defines gender change is male tag become female tag.

It not flawed (for me at least, but some people just stupidly stubborn).

Base +7, Last_Magic -6

I am sorry unintentionally ignoring male futa dilemma you wanted an answer to in my last post. Again i'm clarifing I am being a devil's advocate, I understand where you are coming from.

With the tags we have now a male futa you would use the otokofutanari tag which is defined "A male with both a vagina and a penis." It's total nonissue. Although I think that's cheating, since it is a very recent term. Before that typically the cuntboy tag would be added as well as "male:gender bender"(as that was the original tag of it), and most people did vote against the male:futanari even though it could be appropriate in these rare cases.

That situation was, and still is, extremely rare most people into gender change didn't like that subgenre so no one really cared if it was tagged 'wrong' at the time. Yes it was hypocritical.

Beside that inconsistent exception, Gender Bender was consistently tagged with that assumed logic I mentioned before. For male->shemale only the feminization and shemale tags were used to signify it instead, but was bit of a crap shoot as that could just mean a shemale was in the work not that the male turned into a shemale. The only time gender bender tag was only invoked if the male became a female or futanari in the same work, This is why IngmarS kept on spamming " IF HIS GENDER ACTUALLY CHANGES". Because that's how it was done for over a decade and a half.

Base +6

"Just tell them to read the definition for "feminization", the ruling is already there. I'm not sure if I want to keep adding more notes to the gender changing tags, stuff is already one of the most lengthy definitions we have on this site.

FWIW, a male turning into a dickgirl (futanari/shemale), is in fact, considered as gender change on this site." -end quote

Then admin should add dickgirl tag to include this annoying debate. Rather than using futanari exclusive.

Base +7, NkFlower -6

Oh my god the admins finally changed the gender change wiki definition to relfect their judgement, thank you monnoroth. This exactly I was hoping the admins would do one day.

Sorry to bug you again, but I just know this other issue will never be enforced otherwise. If I remember right the admins judement includes not counting characters like tanya or cagliostro as gender change.

I am going to use another site's tagging system as a metaphor (e621) to explain the admins judgement. Both tanya and cagliostro gender change are (lore) based, our site tagging system is visual based, if you see it tag it. This site however does not consider implied things (lore) to be worth tagging. While tanya's change happened within the 1st chapter/episode in the work, cagliostro's change is only implied, either way the change does not happen in the gallery works and most works just treat both characters as girls not men that became girls. Combine the two observations it is only vaguely gender change related at best, so the admins don't see the point have them tagged in the first place.

The issue is just as bad male->shemale thing. "For parodies (e.g. female ranma saotome) the change itself does not have to be shown." supports this assumption that tanya or cagliostro count as gender change. All have to do you point to the show/manga the characters totally fits the definition. Yes I know it's a visual tag and presence is important. But there's nothing contradicting that tanya or cagliostro from counting as gender change either. Maybe "their usual one through any means" since the female form is the one that has most if not all their screen time, where as ranma flip flops between sexes in his show but this seems a bit flimsy as well.

Base +6

That was far streched from our talk @MedNed, I suggest to contact admin yourself.

Base +7

That is fair, but I feel burned with the admins, monnoroth.

I went to the forums after your first incident with IngmarS about august or september last year to hash things out. I gave them simlar suggestions I gave you here maybe being a lot more wordy and autistic as well. It from my impression it seemed to me that they were going to implement some changes to the wiki definitions, so I checked out. But those changes didn't happen until we butted heads here in this gallery comments. So from my perspective you got more pull with the admins. Granted it could just be how many times this bullshit has happened and they are tired of this shit or you are just less annoying to the admins than me.

But thanks to your efforts here I will give it another college try, I just don't expect much. Have a nice day, monnoroth.

Base +6

Waiting for the Alhaithan doujins too
Can't purchase them

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